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Thread: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

  1. #11
    Sniper benja455's Avatar
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dime is Money
    So... what, you want to have Iraq and Afghanistan end up like [South] Vietnam?
    Wow...nice job changing the subject. Completely different war, completely different context, completely different era...also, Vietnam was paid for with real money - not loans from China. You want the war?...figure out a way to actually pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dime is Money
    No; the wars are against terrorism, and as far as I know, terrorism still exists in those regions.
    Terrorism is a political strategy. It exists in many regions, most of those regions the US military is not deployed to. With that said, terrorist groups only exist in Iraq because of the power vacuum we left there after deposing Sadam. But that's really not the point here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dime is Money
    I suppose you're fine with your kids or grandchildren being deployed over there yet again because we failed to finish the job the first time.
    I supposed you're fine with your kids or grandchilden being deployed to a Chinese labor camp because we have no way to pay back all the money we borrowed for those stupid wars.

    Quote Originally Posted by molon.labe View Post
    you are so high speed.
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  2. #12
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    @ Dime is Money:

    You state that the wars are not over because they are against terrorism. Can you give me a good ETA on when we might win the war against terrorism? How do you define when it is won? It is an idea you are waging war against.

    You cannot win a war against an idea or feeling unless you obliterate -any way to feel or act a certain way, and at that point you are no longer living in a free society. If you want to live in a communist society there are plenty of them out there to move to.

    "I see it now a super hero called Sir Tugsalot" dementia speaking of Tugtug's superhero alter ego.

  3. #13
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    Quote Originally Posted by benja455

    Yep. Here's a quick and easy plan to balance the budget and start paying down the federal debt. End all three wars (Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya), end the Bush tax cuts and start working on creating jobs (which would increase tax revenue on all levels).

    You're welcome.
    Explain to me how Bush managed to run 2 much larger scale wars, and managed to keep his tax cuts, yet only ran $300 to $300 billion deficit yearly?

    Fast forward to Demo's getting control of congress and Obama coming into office - since Obama got into office, the debt has risen to $225 billion this last February alone (One friggen month- a record!), nearly $1.5 trillion in deficit spending, and the democrat controlled congress has nearly bankrupted us by bringing our national dent from $8 Trillion to over $14 friggen Trillion in two friggen years! An increase of of 60%!!!! Well, more than 2 years - it started to spike when democrats took control of Congress in 2007. The last two years have really been the bulk of it.

    Let me give you a new plan - Fire all Democrats!

    You're welcome.

    -X

    PS. Just thinking about this, and I am getting ticked - the numbers are not adding up! There are two budgets - the one we know about and the one we don't know about. How do you get to $14 Trillion in the short time the Democrats took control of Congress? They have to be spending more than $1.5 Trillion per year! THey have only had control since the end of 2006, so you can't start counting till 2007!


  4. #14
    Sniper benja455's Avatar
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    Quote Originally Posted by xman1
    Explain to me how Bush managed to run 2 much larger scale wars, and managed to keep his tax cuts, yet only ran $300 to $300 billion deficit yearly?
    1) He had a surplus to burn through first.

    2) The banks and car companies (except for Ford) all failed...the bail outs required a ton of cash to be put out by the Feds even if it was going to be paid back eventually.

    3) The stimulus plan was basically a bunch of tax cuts. So, that's a metric crap ton of money which disappeared into thin air.

    4) Are you f-ing serious? The economy tanked! Tax revenues are down! It's simple math. z

    Sometimes I wonder if you tinfoilhat guys on this board read over what you've written before you post it. You go back to only voting for Republicans...I'm sure you'll see the whole universe B60 magically B60 change and all of our problems disappear. gergz You sound like the kids drinking the Obama Kool-Aid in 2008.

    This thread was not a Dems vs. Republican discussion before you got here - it was a discussion about the budget. Both parties are at fault.

    Quote Originally Posted by molon.labe View Post
    you are so high speed.
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  5. #15
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    I think someone if smoking crack at the facts.

    1.) He may have increased spending due to some wars, but his was a drop in the bucket comparatively.

    2.) The banks and car companies should have been allowed to fail! They needed a restructuring. This was meddling in what should have righted itself on its own. Congress however decided to see if they could do something about it and made it worse!

    3.) The stimulus plan won't put a dent in the spending increases in the last 2 years (during an economic recovery mind you, but you are leaving that fact out)

    4.) When your revenue goes down, so does your spending. Simple economics. You don't increase spending. Democrats increased spending. Democrats increased spending not by a little either, but A LOT! BIG FAIL!!!! Not only did they increase it, they increased it astronomically and it is rising as we speak. Economy is back on track with an increase at 3% to 4% - close to some of our best times, so your math is not adding up if you blame this on a recession! This spending is happening at $1.5 Trillion per year right now! And that is only what we know of. Your bank bail outs were not in the budget I speak of. They were in the unknown budget that is not reported on!

    If you even try to blame this problem on a Republican, you need to be hunted down like a dog and slapped! slizap

    Anyway, I can see an education is needed on this subject so we must analyze in detail later on when I have more time.

    -X


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    Sniper benja455's Avatar
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    -X,

    You are cracking me up.

    Quote Originally Posted by xman1
    If you even try to blame this problem on a Republican, you need to be hunted down like a dog and slapped! slizap
    ks ks ks ks

    You've got to be joking right? Sspartan Both political parties are the problem.

    Anyway...ummm, you keep drinking the GOP Kool-Aid and everything will be alright. In the meantime, it seems your saviors have refused to eliminate the tax cuts for the oil companies:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/18/us/po ... gress.html

    Ha, ha...oh dear...you're a funny guy, X...keep doing your thing. tinfoilhat

    Quote Originally Posted by molon.labe View Post
    you are so high speed.
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  7. #17
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    Let us not forget 4.50 gas, largest expansion of government in history, 2 unfunded wars, largest surplus to largest defect, bank bailouts and the creation it tarp. All under republican watch. It is both parties! !


  8. #18
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    I believe the problems we now face in the budget are due in part to the mindset of the people making the decisions for our country.

    Kennedy said ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country. I believe all government jobs are service jobs. It is an honor to service the country. And monetary compensation is a necesity for surivival. The honor is the true compensation. Politics is not a career! It is a tool to get things done. Can I have a career in hammer? I am not convinced everyone sees it that way.

    I believe government employees should be paid what "we" can afford to pay them, say maybe the average income of john q tax payer. You too prez! Employees need to be accountable for their decisions and how much those decisions cost the governement, in this case. Maybe someone should be fired? I know I would be fired for costing my employer 10 times my yearly salary for a dumb decision I convinced everyone would work.

    It seems like there is no motivation to do a good job, there is only motivation to take more from "us" and move up the political ladder, make more money, and hide from accountability behind the curtain of bureaucracy. How is it fair the representatives of this nation do not live like the rest of the nation?

    My understanding of the problem is very simplistic. I do not claim to have much experience in understanding the scope of such a missive, global and infititely complex set of variables. I am human. And that is my point. None of the people we pay to make decisions on our behalf can understand it all either.

    Fundamentally, the governement, in my opinion, is too large and too complex. I would appreciate a more simple approach. The recession is a perfect example. It would be wrong and dangerous for me to spend more than I make. To continue to pay for a maid I cannot afford. And borrow more to pay for what I cannot afford to pay already. It sounds like that is what is happening with "our" money.

    The two party system, in my opinion, is a great way to keep the country at odds with itself, so we cannot unite against our oppressors. It worked even within this microcosm, in this one thread, where we all agree there is a problem, but finding blame is easier than finding solutions.

    This thread makes me sick, much like everything I hear about what "we" are doing with our tax dollars. And that is all it boils down to in my opinion. What should "we" do with "our" tax dollars. But it feels more like "us" and "them".

    Hey government, THAT IS OUR MONEY YOU'RE SPENDING!!! or have you forgotten?

    If the people we employ are not smart or honest or selfless enough to balance our budget, then how can they be trusted to do anything more important. Budget is priority number one in everyone's life that I know. Why is it not the governemnt's priority? If you can't keep the power on in your house and you are behind on the mortage six months, is it wise to have a bbq for the neighborhood on the 4th of July and blow up a bunch of money in big bangs and pretty colors?

    Simple.

    Many, many Americans are broke, in debt over their heads... and still borrowing! The government is a reflection of themselves. I guess that makes this situation more palatable. If we hate the government spending, we hate ourselves. Maybe that was someone's goal all along. I don't know.

    I am at least glad there is a forum to release these thoughts so I do not emplode or explode. I hope others have a similar avenue for release.

    Thanks SGN.

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  9. #19
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    [quote=benja455]
    Quote Originally Posted by Dime is Money
    So... what, you want to have Iraq and Afghanistan end up like [South] Vietnam?
    Wow...nice job changing the subject. Completely different war, completely different context, completely different era...also, Vietnam was paid for with real money - not loans from China. You want the war?...figure out a way to actually pay for it.

    Quote Originally Posted by "Dime is Money":3nt6fojy
    No; the wars are against terrorism, and as far as I know, terrorism still exists in those regions.
    Terrorism is a political strategy. It exists in many regions, most of those regions the US military is not deployed to. With that said, terrorist groups only exist in Iraq because of the power vacuum we left there after deposing Sadam. But that's really not the point here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dime is Money
    I suppose you're fine with your kids or grandchildren being deployed over there yet again because we failed to finish the job the first time.
    I supposed you're fine with your kids or grandchilden being deployed to a Chinese labor camp because we have no way to pay back all the money we borrowed for those stupid wars.[/quote:3nt6fojy]

    What made you infer that I was trying to change the subject? There were no implications that I wanted to argue about Vietnam. But since you bring it up I might as well explain myself. Vietnam was mentioned because I used it as an example of how we have no control over it after the conflict. Unless you're the kind of person who likes to plug in your red and white RCA cables only and leave the yellow out, the best option (IMO) right now is to finish the job so it's not going to be a mess later.

    And to address more false assumptions about what I said...
    I don't want the war nor do I think anyone else does--besides those who are benefiting off of it obviously. I want us out of there just as much as you do.

    Also I was kind of hoping you guys would make the connection: "Terrorism">terrorists>Al-Qaeda/other hostile factions. I was trying to point out that even though the two head honchos are dead, the conflict still exists (obviously).

    What I'm still waiting on hearing is how you expect us to pull out of the Middle East so quickly.


  10. #20
    Jedi Knight John Brown's Avatar
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    Re: Debt limit reached? Borrow more!

    Just print more money. Problem solved.

    jestera

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